VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd
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Thread: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

  1. #1
    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Hello fellow mk 4 owners and mechanics. I have a 2001 gti vr6 that I recently had the timing chain replaced on. When I picked it up from the mechanic it had the feeling of a misfire happening in 1st, 2nd, 3rd. My mechanic changed the plug wires, spark plugs, and even tried a new ignition coil. This helped the problem but did not fix it completely. It is still slightly there in first and you can feel it mostly in second accelerating under load between 2000 and 3400 rpm's. It is difficult to get it to do in third which is strange. My mechanic also put a new fuel pump and filter in it, and checked the MAF sensor. The problem is it is not tripping a code, so it is all guess work. The only other ideas I have are to replace the fuel pressure regulator or maybe it is a vac hose leak or something. Has anyone else had anything like this? it feels like a little bog that happens three or four times before you hit 32-3400 rpms, then the engine pulls really strong. Mechanic can't figure out why it is mosly only in first and second, and strongest in second. Any ideas would be greatly appreciatted. The car checks out absolutely clean when checked out with the computer so I am getting a little frustrated.
    Cheers,
    Willi

    PS, He is a good mechanic - he did all the ignition and fuel line stuff for free, he wants to fix it as bad as I do. He trained at the euro car school in Ireland and worked for Mercedes for a number of years. He is a good guy, so that is not the problem.
    Thanks in advance.
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    Last edited by Williunck; 07-01-2010 at 11:47 PM.

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  3. #2
    I'm Watching You volcano's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    i suggest taking a look at the timing chains to make sure they are exact

    i had a similar problem this week when my 2.0 timing belt skipped a tooth and had the say problem only had power in higher rpm

    i had a code tho, but dont know if the vr6 will throw a code if the timing chains are off by a bit
    03 GTI 1.8T & 96 GTI 2.0 & 00 Passat Wagon 1.8T


  4. #3
    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    So....check the timing you mean? cause looking at the timing chains would be a huge job, VW dealer drops the whole engine and transmission to do the chains. Seriously though, if the timing were off a bit is this the type of problem you would get? I thought that incorrect timing would basicly cause serious engine damage.
    I really don't know though, I build structures not cars. -
    I should also say that there is good power at the lower rpm's, it just has a little stutter in it. It isn't like it is bogging and feeling really bad til 3000...I can feel it pulling quite good, but I feel this little hesitation 3 or 4 times until 3400 or so. Not huge but it is there.
    Last edited by Williunck; 07-01-2010 at 11:52 PM.

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    I'm Watching You volcano's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    architect or engineer?

    they took out the engine to do the timing chains? that way to much work and i dont think you need to drop the engine to do the chains

    if timing chains is off by 1 tooth then its ok no engine damage will occur

    vr6 dont have a distributor so you can not adjust the timing

    all they have to do is set the engine to TDC and check if all timing marks line up, if they do then thats fine and you got to keep looking for other things
    03 GTI 1.8T & 96 GTI 2.0 & 00 Passat Wagon 1.8T


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    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Hehe, General contractor....houses and buildings. I didn't have the vw dealer do the work because they said they would drop the engine and tranny (not to mention 100 dollars an hour), so I had the local vw guru do it. He did drop the tranny but engine stayed intact. If the timing were off a bit, would it still feel really good at higher rpms? also, i should mention that my fuel economy seems to have dropped a bit since the work. About 2-3 mpg, like it is running rich or something, but it doesn't act like that. I am really baffled, wish i was smarter about this stuff....

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    Spaminator numero uno 07GTIMYFAST's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    check the coilpack,
    and to check cam timing line the crank pully mark up with the mark on the block and pull the valve cover, take 2 pieces of 1/8" aluminum plate and put them in the ends of the camshaftts to see if they sit parrallel with the block, the thicker half of the cam end (more material) should be on the bottom for it to fit, If not rotate the crank a full 360 and try again. If you cant get the plates in and sitting parrallel on top of the head your cam timing is off.

    pretty sure that car has a cam position sensor that would throw a code if it jumped a tooth, and Timing chains dont jump alot. coilpack would be #1 on the list. you can inspect the upper timing chain guides pretty *easy* and that could give you some indication of how much time they have.

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    I'm Watching You volcano's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    yes it will have most of its power at higher rpms if its off by a tooth (the other symptom would be power at low rpm and no power at high rpm)

    i forget if its advanced or retard but its one of those

    like i said, i had the same problem on my car this week and the timing belt was the problem. but in my car its only a 45min job.

    i had no power at low rpm but after 3.5k it took of normally
    Last edited by volcano; 07-02-2010 at 12:16 AM.
    03 GTI 1.8T & 96 GTI 2.0 & 00 Passat Wagon 1.8T


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    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by 07GTIMYFAST View Post
    check the coilpack,
    pretty sure that car has a cam position sensor that would throw a code if it jumped a tooth, and Timing chains dont jump alot. coilpack would be #1 on the list. you can inspect the upper timing chain guides pretty *easy* and that could give you some indication of how much time they have.
    I just had the timing chians ( both upper and lower, and all four guides/tensioners replaced). Is the coilpack different than the ignition timing coil, cause we replaced the ignition coil also, along with the plugs and wires. Thank you for your reply, all ideas are very welcome at this point.

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    I'm Watching You volcano's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by 07GTIMYFAST View Post
    check the coilpack,
    and to check cam timing line the crank pully mark up with the mark on the block and pull the valve cover, take 2 pieces of 1/8" aluminum plate and put them in the ends of the camshaftts to see if they sit parrallel with the block, the thicker half of the cam end (more material) should be on the bottom for it to fit, If not rotate the crank a full 360 and try again. If you cant get the plates in and sitting parrallel on top of the head your cam timing is off.

    pretty sure that car has a cam position sensor that would throw a code if it jumped a tooth, and Timing chains dont jump alot. coilpack would be #1 on the list. you can inspect the upper timing chain guides pretty *easy* and that could give you some indication of how much time they have.

    he change the coil pack

    and problem started after replacing the timing chains, so it could have been installed incorrectly not necessarily jumped a tooth.

    even the best mechanics make mistakes, first time i did the TB on my 2.0 the intermediate shaft was way off

    i agree with you on the cam part tho
    03 GTI 1.8T & 96 GTI 2.0 & 00 Passat Wagon 1.8T


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    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by volcano View Post
    yes it will have most of its power at higher rpms if its off by a tooth (the other symptom would be power at low rpm and no power at high rpm)

    i forget if its advanced or retard but its one of those

    like i said, i had the same problem on my car this week and the timing belt was the problem. but in my car its only a 45min job.

    i had not power at low rpm but after 3.5k it took of normally
    Christ....if the timing is off I am going to flip my $%#^....the owner of the shop was trained by Mercedes - I can't imagine they would botch a timing job, but maybe so.................

    I did read on one of the forums of someone with a VR6 having a VERY similiar problem, a low rpm stutter felt mostly in second gear, but his triggered a code before too long, mine has been a month now. his had something to do with a leaking vacuum line near the rear of the engine.....I don't even know what part of my vr6 uses a vacuum line. Could this be it?
    Last edited by Williunck; 07-02-2010 at 12:47 AM.

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    Spaminator numero uno 07GTIMYFAST's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    vacuum line could be causing your poor fuel economy. I'm not sure about the running issue, usually you will have a rougher idle with a vacuum leak

  13. #12
    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    fook me, this is really bumming me out. The car is so sweet otherwise, and ran so strong before this. I took it in for a timing chain with NO other problems and I got it back with this problem. What to do? It makes me crazy.

    Ps. not actually going to kill myself so nobody freak out.
    Last edited by Williunck; 07-02-2010 at 01:03 AM.

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    Spaminator numero uno 07GTIMYFAST's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    take it back to the mechanic, if he is as good as you say and a standup guy tell him you didn't have this problem before he worked on it and now you do, be nice about it and he might hook you up.

  15. #14
    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by 07GTIMYFAST View Post
    take it back to the mechanic, if he is as good as you say and a standup guy tell him you didn't have this problem before he worked on it and now you do, be nice about it and he might hook you up.
    I have had it back, and the things he has tried he did for free. He suggested I drive it for a bit to see if a code will come up, but so far none have. I was just hoping someone else might have experienced this so I could give him some ideas. Maybe I will ask him to check the timing, and I read somewhere there is a way to check for vacuum leaks.
    Thanks

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    Dubber In Training Williunck's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    OK, a little update - back at the shop again and the mechanic did the vacuum test and it came out clean, no leaks. He also checked the timing, even though the cam sensor would have tripped a code, timed correctly. So, I have only a few more ideas since it isn't the fuel pump, filter, the MAF sensor, the Ignition coil, Wires, spark plugs, timing, or a vacuum leak. Maybe the fuel pressure regulator even though it reads on the computer as functioning properly, or maybe the O2 sensor. Could I have gotten a bad set of OEM plug wires? Any other Ideas would be greatly appreciatted.

  17. #16
    I'm Watching You volcano's Avatar
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    Default Re: VR6 stutter...1st and 2nd

    Quote Originally Posted by Williunck View Post
    OK, a little update - back at the shop again and the mechanic did the vacuum test and it came out clean, no leaks. He also checked the timing, even though the cam sensor would have tripped a code, timed correctly. So, I have only a few more ideas since it isn't the fuel pump, filter, the MAF sensor, the Ignition coil, Wires, spark plugs, timing, or a vacuum leak. Maybe the fuel pressure regulator even though it reads on the computer as functioning properly, or maybe the O2 sensor. Could I have gotten a bad set of OEM plug wires? Any other Ideas would be greatly appreciatted.

    there is always a chance of getting bad parts
    03 GTI 1.8T & 96 GTI 2.0 & 00 Passat Wagon 1.8T


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